Troy Review
May. 15th, 2004 10:17 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
tanithryudoYes, so, ![[insanejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/ij-userinfo.gif)
cashew and I watched "Troy" today.
Here's some advice toossian if you want to watch it, either in the theaters or on DVD:
1) Skip the first 15 minutes or so of the movie.
2) Stop watching right about the time that Achilles drags Hector's body back to camp. Everything after that DID NOT HAPPEN, dangit.
3) Close your eyes every time Helen, Paris (except for his fight with Menelaus), or Briseis appears onscreen.
Everything else (which is like, half the movie?) is watchable, even good at times, wich was a very pleasant surprise for us. Then again, I guess going into the theater with rock bottom expectations sorta made any positive aspects of the film a pleasant surprise.
THE CHARACTERS
Achilles - For most of the film (excluding the Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen), Achilles was a pretty spot on character. He's maybe portrayed a bit more sympathetic than in the Iliad, but he was pretty well done in all of the war scenes and in relation to Patroclus. Brad Pitt did a great job of making the character shine, despite the fact that some parts of the script was just horrible, and some of his lines were uber cheesy. (Seriously, there were times when you can almost feel Pitt going "WTF? You want me to say what?!".) He had excellent chemistry going with Patroclus (the slashy kind), as well as Odysseus, Hector, and his Myrmidons (of the non-slashy kind). His battle scenes were excellent, showing just how far this demigod was above the mere mortals around him. Seriously, Pitt did an excellent job, especially considering what he had to work with. The only bad part was the romance thing with Briseis (more on this later) and the totally WTF moment that is the Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen.
Hector - The other main character of the movie, and Eric Bana did a great job there as well. Nearly *all* of his scenes were excellent, and his character was pretty well developed (within the scope of the movie). He's also a very sympathetic character, which means that his death at least maintains something of the whole "Greek Tragedy" angle of the story. He also got some nice battle scenes showing off his skillz, before he fell to the Force of Nature that was Achilles Out For Revenge.
The ONLY, only scene that was totally out of character (of the movie character, that is) for Hector was at the end of Paris' duel with Menelaus, where we see this very noble and honorable man, out of no logical reason or rationale at all, do a totally dishonorable thing. Menelaus and Paris had agreed to one-on-one duel. Menelaus beat Paris fair and square. Menelaus was going for Paris, not Hector, because the duel was not supposed to concern Hector. And Hector had no right to kill Menelaus without even telling the guy he was getting involved in the duel. The honorable might be for him to knock away Menelaus' sword and announce that he's fighting in Paris' stead. But he didn't do that. He did the equivalent of backstabbing Menelaus when the other guy was turned. That was not an honorable thing to do. That was not in the best interests of Troy. That was not in the best interests of Peace. Hector didn't know that Agamemnon didn't plan to uphold the agreement of the duel. Therefore, he chose the family brat over Troy and peace (the things he said he fought for) and his honor. That just sucked.
Paris - 80% of his appearances in the movie were totally unneccessary. They could have been cut. They serve no purpose except to cater fanservice to the Orlando fangirls. Basically, everything outside of him telling Hector that he stole Helen and his fight with Menelaus was superfluous to the movie. Yes, that includes the part in the Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen where he shoots Achilles too. And the Romance angle? Ick. Ickickick. Like, totally gag me. Really, it was like watching excerpts from some other modern romance flick being randomly inserted into a historical drama.
However, I'll say this for Bloom. He did a pretty good job with the only scene that wasn't superfluous. Bloom's acting ability isn't under criticism here; it's the writer's fault that most of his scenes/lines were moronic and overly sacharrine. However, in the fight with Menelaus, Orlando did an awesome job of portraying the totally inexperience and incompetent boy who has no idea how to fight, and is basically quivering in his armor/helmet even as he walks up to Menelaus. He also did a great job of playing the craven loser who goes crawling back to Hector after Menelaus beats him up. If ever Bloom plays a cowardly bad guy in some film, I think he's got some great potential for the role.
Agamemnon - Got totally jipped in the movie. Basically, he didn't commit the wrongs that he commited in the Iliad, and did commit some wrongs that he didn't commit in the epic. *facepalm* The writers were on crack. He was totally villainized, yes, though I did think that once they killed off Menelaus, he's got some right to his villainy afterwards. As well, there was the Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen... let's just say that we won't have to worry about an adaptation of the Oresteia or any of that sort as a sequel to Troy.
Menelaus - Got jipped even more than Agamemnon did. If there was anyone in the movie who deserved sympathy and who didn't deserve any of the stuff that happened to him, it's Menelaus. The guy pursues Peace with the Trojans and gives them hospitality... and has his wife running away with his guest. He goes and duels the guy for his honor... and gets killed when someone else practically backstabs him. That's just wrong. Especially when Paris and Helen gets to live "happily ever after". That's. Just. Wrong.
Odysseus - Sean Bean did a really great job with Odysseus. In addition, I think he's the character who stayed the closest to the Iliad throughout the movie. He's the diplomat and the strategist. He's got Achilles' respect, but is not the one who can change Achilles' mind. If they do a sequel for the "Odyssey", I really think Sean Bean can pull it off.
Also interesting is the chemistry Odysseus has with Achilles. Not talking about the slashy kind. But there was some serious telepathy going on. When Achilles was sitting out the fighting because of Agamemnon's insult to him, he looked on as the Greek forces were losing badly to the Trojans, muttering about how stupid Agamemnon is and what maneuvers or whatever they *ought* to be employing. Not so coincidentally, Odysseus was yelling out the same orders Achilles was muttering. Heh. Funny that.
Patroclus - Ha! What can I say? In a surprise from a movie outta Hollywood, the subtext is preserved!! ^_~ It's just too bad that he didn't appear onscreen nearly enough, and they did change his genealogy and age. But he definitely had that homoerotic chemistry going on with Achilles! The... "roughing around" they were doing when Odysseus came with the news of the war? The "holding tight and whispering in the ears" before Achilles leads the charge onto the beach? The total resentment Patroclus had when Achilles decides to pack up for home because of Briseis? Total jealousy there. And dang, I've got this plot bunny right here that's just waiting for me to nudge a few events around and fill in some missing scenes. ^_-
Helen - They ruined her character. Seriously, they did. In their pathetic attempt to create a "strong woman" of the modern sensibility and overplay the whole "romance" angle, the only thing they succeeded in doing is creating another Pandora. In the Iliad Helen at least had the excuse that she was just a pawn in the machinations of the gods, and had no choice in her role of starting the war. Here she purposefully chose to elope with Paris and cause the deaths of many on both sides of the war... she basically put her own selfish needs and lustful hormones over the peace and well-being of two peoples.
Priam - Of all the characterizations that were slaughtered in the film, Priam probably got the worst of it. In the Iliad he gave Paris hell for stealing Helen. In the movie he practically welcomes her as a new daughter. And for most of the film he plays the contrast of the senile, foolishly pious moron to Hector's oft-ignored words of common sense.
And the most important scene for Priam in the Iliad, where he begs Achilles for Hector's body? *gag* Instead of humbly grovelling at the man who can kill him then and there and has his son's body, movie-Priam is all but demanding that Achilles do what he says. Not to mention the total condescension of his words, as if he has some kind of moral high ground to stand on (which in the context of the movie, he really doesn't). And when he *tries* to grovel? Dude, he looked more like he was coming onto Achilles, and Achilles (and possibly Brad Pitt) was getting seriously creeped out by this weirdo pervert. Seriously, he goes into Achilles' tent, kneels and kisses Achilles' hands, and Achilles cringes away as if saying "get away from me, you creepo".
Briseis - WTF was she even on-screen for? Oh yeah, 'cause Hollywood can't leave any major character without a heterosexual love interest that just has to be the turning point or foundation of their motivation. *gag* *rolleyes* And definitely, she was a character in the wrong era. Even given her altered genealogy and background, no woman back then would even think of talking like she did, unless they were a goddess or something. Sheesh. Anachronistic much?
Misc. Others - There were a couple of nice throwaway cameo characters that were worth noting as well. Ajax got some nice scenes, though his main job was to establish how awesome Hector was in combat (by dying, duh). Aeneas got a showing when people were fleeing Troy from a secret passage; that was neat. Achilles' second in command... some guy named Eudoras (dunno if he's canon or not)... seemed pretty cool. Andromache and her baby were excellently played. Nestor as an advisor to Agamemnon, though he didn't get the role of telling the Trojans about the Horse, also was a nice touch.
THE PLOT
The timeline - They squished a war that lasted decades to a time frame of less than 3 weeks. And they call this a war that'll go down in history?! Maybe the Shortest War In History, maybe. *rolleyes*
The First ~15 minutes - The prologue thingy with Agammemnon going for Thessaly was totally pointless and irrelevant to the story. It was supposed to set up the characters for Achilles and Agamemnon, but really, they could've done that well enough if they started with Agamemnon planning for the Trojan War and Odysseus talking Achilles about joining the war party. The conflict between Achilles and Agamemnon could start up well enough as it was done in the movie without the setup in Thessally. So I really don't know why it was even there.
All Paris/Helen scenes - *cringe* Ugh *gag* Feh. That's all I really have to say about that.
All Briseis scenes - What era are we supposed to be in again? Why is she even anything more than a trophy... thing to be quibbled about in a obscure point of honor between Achilles and Agamemnon? The girl needs to be thrown off a high cliff. Verily. Or actually, better to just repress the memories of her existence. Yeah... just lemme get my Omega-Beam/History-Eraser-Button thingy here...
The day time battle scenes - Very well done. Whether with CGI or with actors duking it out, it was very well done. The Myrmidons? Totally earned their rep in Achilles' charge on the beach.
The Trojan sneak attack on the Greek camp at night - Uhhh.... Rolling balls of fire? WTF? That's late Roman era, if that. I think the writer just made that part up.
Achilles desecrating the temple of Apollo - Uhh... that was Agamemnon's part, but who's counting? *rolleyes* Achilles shouldn't really have a reason to be impious, since he's (in canon) the son of a goddess. But whatever, I guess. It's an aethist movie, so it's not like it should have any consequences, or whatever.
The Trojan Horse - Still looks nothing like a horse. If I was Poseidon (who I guess they make it for in the movie), I'd destroy both the Greeks and the Trojans for (respectively) making and keeping such an ugly and second-rate offering.
The Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen - Basically the last 30 minutes or so of the movie... not only is it non-canon, it's like... 90 degrees perpendicular to canon. The timeline is twisted so that Achilles participates in the Trojan Horse thing... just so he could find Briseis... which is a WTF moment since if he wanted to keep the girl then, duh, he shouldn't've let her go back to the city, yes? And then Briseis kills Agamemnon and Achilles finds her and declares his... whatever... and Paris shoots him a couple of times... um... yeah. It's that bad. Upshot is that Achilles and Agamemnon are dead while Paris & Helen (and Briseis) escape the burning Troy and go live happily ever after or whatever. Blarg. Whatever. I maintain that it simply Did. Not. Happen. The rest of the movie could even be passable without that part. Bleh.
Well, that's it for now... I'll probably add addendums to this review when they occur to me. But that's all the commentary I can remember for now.
Addendum: cashew's review (index)
cashew and I watched "Troy" today.Here's some advice to
ossian if you want to watch it, either in the theaters or on DVD: 1) Skip the first 15 minutes or so of the movie.
2) Stop watching right about the time that Achilles drags Hector's body back to camp. Everything after that DID NOT HAPPEN, dangit.
3) Close your eyes every time Helen, Paris (except for his fight with Menelaus), or Briseis appears onscreen.
Everything else (which is like, half the movie?) is watchable, even good at times, wich was a very pleasant surprise for us. Then again, I guess going into the theater with rock bottom expectations sorta made any positive aspects of the film a pleasant surprise.
THE CHARACTERS
Achilles - For most of the film (excluding the Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen), Achilles was a pretty spot on character. He's maybe portrayed a bit more sympathetic than in the Iliad, but he was pretty well done in all of the war scenes and in relation to Patroclus. Brad Pitt did a great job of making the character shine, despite the fact that some parts of the script was just horrible, and some of his lines were uber cheesy. (Seriously, there were times when you can almost feel Pitt going "WTF? You want me to say what?!".) He had excellent chemistry going with Patroclus (the slashy kind), as well as Odysseus, Hector, and his Myrmidons (of the non-slashy kind). His battle scenes were excellent, showing just how far this demigod was above the mere mortals around him. Seriously, Pitt did an excellent job, especially considering what he had to work with. The only bad part was the romance thing with Briseis (more on this later) and the totally WTF moment that is the Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen.
Hector - The other main character of the movie, and Eric Bana did a great job there as well. Nearly *all* of his scenes were excellent, and his character was pretty well developed (within the scope of the movie). He's also a very sympathetic character, which means that his death at least maintains something of the whole "Greek Tragedy" angle of the story. He also got some nice battle scenes showing off his skillz, before he fell to the Force of Nature that was Achilles Out For Revenge.
The ONLY, only scene that was totally out of character (of the movie character, that is) for Hector was at the end of Paris' duel with Menelaus, where we see this very noble and honorable man, out of no logical reason or rationale at all, do a totally dishonorable thing. Menelaus and Paris had agreed to one-on-one duel. Menelaus beat Paris fair and square. Menelaus was going for Paris, not Hector, because the duel was not supposed to concern Hector. And Hector had no right to kill Menelaus without even telling the guy he was getting involved in the duel. The honorable might be for him to knock away Menelaus' sword and announce that he's fighting in Paris' stead. But he didn't do that. He did the equivalent of backstabbing Menelaus when the other guy was turned. That was not an honorable thing to do. That was not in the best interests of Troy. That was not in the best interests of Peace. Hector didn't know that Agamemnon didn't plan to uphold the agreement of the duel. Therefore, he chose the family brat over Troy and peace (the things he said he fought for) and his honor. That just sucked.
Paris - 80% of his appearances in the movie were totally unneccessary. They could have been cut. They serve no purpose except to cater fanservice to the Orlando fangirls. Basically, everything outside of him telling Hector that he stole Helen and his fight with Menelaus was superfluous to the movie. Yes, that includes the part in the Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen where he shoots Achilles too. And the Romance angle? Ick. Ickickick. Like, totally gag me. Really, it was like watching excerpts from some other modern romance flick being randomly inserted into a historical drama.
However, I'll say this for Bloom. He did a pretty good job with the only scene that wasn't superfluous. Bloom's acting ability isn't under criticism here; it's the writer's fault that most of his scenes/lines were moronic and overly sacharrine. However, in the fight with Menelaus, Orlando did an awesome job of portraying the totally inexperience and incompetent boy who has no idea how to fight, and is basically quivering in his armor/helmet even as he walks up to Menelaus. He also did a great job of playing the craven loser who goes crawling back to Hector after Menelaus beats him up. If ever Bloom plays a cowardly bad guy in some film, I think he's got some great potential for the role.
Agamemnon - Got totally jipped in the movie. Basically, he didn't commit the wrongs that he commited in the Iliad, and did commit some wrongs that he didn't commit in the epic. *facepalm* The writers were on crack. He was totally villainized, yes, though I did think that once they killed off Menelaus, he's got some right to his villainy afterwards. As well, there was the Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen... let's just say that we won't have to worry about an adaptation of the Oresteia or any of that sort as a sequel to Troy.
Menelaus - Got jipped even more than Agamemnon did. If there was anyone in the movie who deserved sympathy and who didn't deserve any of the stuff that happened to him, it's Menelaus. The guy pursues Peace with the Trojans and gives them hospitality... and has his wife running away with his guest. He goes and duels the guy for his honor... and gets killed when someone else practically backstabs him. That's just wrong. Especially when Paris and Helen gets to live "happily ever after". That's. Just. Wrong.
Odysseus - Sean Bean did a really great job with Odysseus. In addition, I think he's the character who stayed the closest to the Iliad throughout the movie. He's the diplomat and the strategist. He's got Achilles' respect, but is not the one who can change Achilles' mind. If they do a sequel for the "Odyssey", I really think Sean Bean can pull it off.
Also interesting is the chemistry Odysseus has with Achilles. Not talking about the slashy kind. But there was some serious telepathy going on. When Achilles was sitting out the fighting because of Agamemnon's insult to him, he looked on as the Greek forces were losing badly to the Trojans, muttering about how stupid Agamemnon is and what maneuvers or whatever they *ought* to be employing. Not so coincidentally, Odysseus was yelling out the same orders Achilles was muttering. Heh. Funny that.
Patroclus - Ha! What can I say? In a surprise from a movie outta Hollywood, the subtext is preserved!! ^_~ It's just too bad that he didn't appear onscreen nearly enough, and they did change his genealogy and age. But he definitely had that homoerotic chemistry going on with Achilles! The... "roughing around" they were doing when Odysseus came with the news of the war? The "holding tight and whispering in the ears" before Achilles leads the charge onto the beach? The total resentment Patroclus had when Achilles decides to pack up for home because of Briseis? Total jealousy there. And dang, I've got this plot bunny right here that's just waiting for me to nudge a few events around and fill in some missing scenes. ^_-
Helen - They ruined her character. Seriously, they did. In their pathetic attempt to create a "strong woman" of the modern sensibility and overplay the whole "romance" angle, the only thing they succeeded in doing is creating another Pandora. In the Iliad Helen at least had the excuse that she was just a pawn in the machinations of the gods, and had no choice in her role of starting the war. Here she purposefully chose to elope with Paris and cause the deaths of many on both sides of the war... she basically put her own selfish needs and lustful hormones over the peace and well-being of two peoples.
Priam - Of all the characterizations that were slaughtered in the film, Priam probably got the worst of it. In the Iliad he gave Paris hell for stealing Helen. In the movie he practically welcomes her as a new daughter. And for most of the film he plays the contrast of the senile, foolishly pious moron to Hector's oft-ignored words of common sense.
And the most important scene for Priam in the Iliad, where he begs Achilles for Hector's body? *gag* Instead of humbly grovelling at the man who can kill him then and there and has his son's body, movie-Priam is all but demanding that Achilles do what he says. Not to mention the total condescension of his words, as if he has some kind of moral high ground to stand on (which in the context of the movie, he really doesn't). And when he *tries* to grovel? Dude, he looked more like he was coming onto Achilles, and Achilles (and possibly Brad Pitt) was getting seriously creeped out by this weirdo pervert. Seriously, he goes into Achilles' tent, kneels and kisses Achilles' hands, and Achilles cringes away as if saying "get away from me, you creepo".
Briseis - WTF was she even on-screen for? Oh yeah, 'cause Hollywood can't leave any major character without a heterosexual love interest that just has to be the turning point or foundation of their motivation. *gag* *rolleyes* And definitely, she was a character in the wrong era. Even given her altered genealogy and background, no woman back then would even think of talking like she did, unless they were a goddess or something. Sheesh. Anachronistic much?
Misc. Others - There were a couple of nice throwaway cameo characters that were worth noting as well. Ajax got some nice scenes, though his main job was to establish how awesome Hector was in combat (by dying, duh). Aeneas got a showing when people were fleeing Troy from a secret passage; that was neat. Achilles' second in command... some guy named Eudoras (dunno if he's canon or not)... seemed pretty cool. Andromache and her baby were excellently played. Nestor as an advisor to Agamemnon, though he didn't get the role of telling the Trojans about the Horse, also was a nice touch.
THE PLOT
The timeline - They squished a war that lasted decades to a time frame of less than 3 weeks. And they call this a war that'll go down in history?! Maybe the Shortest War In History, maybe. *rolleyes*
The First ~15 minutes - The prologue thingy with Agammemnon going for Thessaly was totally pointless and irrelevant to the story. It was supposed to set up the characters for Achilles and Agamemnon, but really, they could've done that well enough if they started with Agamemnon planning for the Trojan War and Odysseus talking Achilles about joining the war party. The conflict between Achilles and Agamemnon could start up well enough as it was done in the movie without the setup in Thessally. So I really don't know why it was even there.
All Paris/Helen scenes - *cringe* Ugh *gag* Feh. That's all I really have to say about that.
All Briseis scenes - What era are we supposed to be in again? Why is she even anything more than a trophy... thing to be quibbled about in a obscure point of honor between Achilles and Agamemnon? The girl needs to be thrown off a high cliff. Verily. Or actually, better to just repress the memories of her existence. Yeah... just lemme get my Omega-Beam/History-Eraser-Button thingy here...
The day time battle scenes - Very well done. Whether with CGI or with actors duking it out, it was very well done. The Myrmidons? Totally earned their rep in Achilles' charge on the beach.
The Trojan sneak attack on the Greek camp at night - Uhhh.... Rolling balls of fire? WTF? That's late Roman era, if that. I think the writer just made that part up.
Achilles desecrating the temple of Apollo - Uhh... that was Agamemnon's part, but who's counting? *rolleyes* Achilles shouldn't really have a reason to be impious, since he's (in canon) the son of a goddess. But whatever, I guess. It's an aethist movie, so it's not like it should have any consequences, or whatever.
The Trojan Horse - Still looks nothing like a horse. If I was Poseidon (who I guess they make it for in the movie), I'd destroy both the Greeks and the Trojans for (respectively) making and keeping such an ugly and second-rate offering.
The Ending-Which-Did-Not-Happen - Basically the last 30 minutes or so of the movie... not only is it non-canon, it's like... 90 degrees perpendicular to canon. The timeline is twisted so that Achilles participates in the Trojan Horse thing... just so he could find Briseis... which is a WTF moment since if he wanted to keep the girl then, duh, he shouldn't've let her go back to the city, yes? And then Briseis kills Agamemnon and Achilles finds her and declares his... whatever... and Paris shoots him a couple of times... um... yeah. It's that bad. Upshot is that Achilles and Agamemnon are dead while Paris & Helen (and Briseis) escape the burning Troy and go live happily ever after or whatever. Blarg. Whatever. I maintain that it simply Did. Not. Happen. The rest of the movie could even be passable without that part. Bleh.
Well, that's it for now... I'll probably add addendums to this review when they occur to me. But that's all the commentary I can remember for now.
Addendum: cashew's review (index)
